This is EXACTLY how I felt! My husband and I discussed this at length last night trying to figure out why we hated it so much. Even the end was not satisfying enough. It felt empty and hollow, like her death just ties it all up into a nice bow. You nailed it Michelangelo. Thank you for being more articulate than I.
Very interesting perspective Michelangelo. I watched it over the weekend and was both repulsed and dissatisfied by it. I hadn't considered that what repulsed me was a perverted, possibly right wing view of "strong women" or feminism in general.
That being said women who behave just as teribble as powerful men do exist. Maybe they are not criminals, but I've seen it in government, journalism, even in the US Attorney Office. What I've also noticed is that these same women do use exxagerated femininity when it serves their purpose. I feel like this approach holds progress back for all of us. My personal opinion is that we cannot achieve equality by immulating the worst examples of behavior and even if we could that would create a nightmare of a society.
It was frustrating to see this female character be rewarded for her bad actions before being killed in the end.
I also was not aware this was being characterized as an LGBTQ film. The lesbian relationship was barely part of the plot and wasn't developed in any meaningful way. Netflix has done some really good shows that I have felt really humanized LGBTQ characters and this feels like the opposite of that.
I thought the movie was a great reminder to us that after the pandemic is over, we will still have the largest cohort ever of elders who will need end-of-life care, and the options for that are daunting. What I didn't like was that the evil antagonist was constructed as lesbian, a throwback to the days of the Hayes Commission censorship that allowed queer characters in films so long as they were monsters who got killed in the end. The story could have been just as compellingly disturbing if the con-artist was cis-het.
I knew I shouldn’t watch this movie due to the subject matter (spoke with too many senior customers at a previous temp job who had been scammed by salespersons and it took a toll on me emotionally).
The executive ranks of large companies, entertainment et al are still comprised of mainly white men so until there is more diversity, the bias will continue. And those men need to wake up and be part of the drive for change.
I'm a big Pike fan, since her Gone Girl role. I liked her portrayal, and this movie -- partly because I thought her lesbian relationship was handled pretty well. It was incidental to her character, which is what we want, right? Could have been a submissive man she was bossing around, but it was her tough (dark-skinned) business subordinate. And Pike's character came alive when she rescued her Lesbian Lover! I guess I saw it as a modern take, but one--here you're right, of course--that wouldn't be seen with the subtlety American coastal audiences might bring to it. She's probably going to be seen as the Evil Rich American Dyke abroad. Here in the USA, though, I think we can see her as the Gen-X ice queen who's all about the Benjamins--your Benjamins, that is.
Haven't seen yet, but your thoughtful commentary reminds of me again of the subliminal power of media messages...& how even well-intentioned filmmakers may be too close to see the broader, longterm effects of the stories they tell.
My take on it while watching was at she’s a female Tony Soprano, an anti heroine, but she represents amoral capitalism and exemplifies Trumpian values. That part could have been played by a man or woman, and we want women to have more complicated out-of-the-box parts, so being a bad ass who is also bad didn’t bother me.
I just saw her relationship with her girlfriend as poor writing, because they clearly make her out to be a sociopath and it’s doubtful that that person would be capable of loyalty to another, or feelings of attachment, so I just ignored the lesbian aspect completely. This thing isn’t exactly Citizen Kane.
This is a dystopian possible future being portrayed, where success is gained through screwing the system. She’s Trump, the guy at the end isn’t.
Commenting as a homosexual here: sometimes a gay... is just a gay. My partner and I watched it and thought it was a brilliantly dark social commentary. Did not find it homophobic, at all. Just because the anti-hero(s) are lesbian doesn’t mean they are repping lesbianism and LGBTQ+ rights to the world. We are well past the era where any depiction of non-hetero normative relationships in film need to carry a coded flag for the entire crew of us. She was a villain who got her due and she was in a loving relationship with someone who was equally twisted. They are “Bonnie & Bonnie” criminal archetypes.
I don’t buy that it was a Trumpian narrative, either, unless you’re stating that our entire system of elder neglect and craven capitalism is Trumpian; I think that condition predates and subsumes Trump.
So a guy in a movie can't wear a red hat without being compared to Trump supporter and trying to look into this movie as anything more than what it was is a little ridiculous. Point blank, it was about a horrible person that took advantage of the "law" in that state, allowing her to take advantage of tons of elderly people. She lived her life on the wrong side of the law and morality and got what she deserved. Why does everything have to be politically motivated?
I watched it 2 weeks and I loved it. I didn't see any of the things you saw. TI thought the con artist character was Trump and that her partner was just like the rest of the GOP today. Her being a lesbian didn't make her anymore or less horrible. And yes their are some horrible gay people in the world just like any other group in society. I didn't view the guy who killed her in the end as anyone representing Trump. She had all the characteristics of Trump. I didn't even notice the guy wore a red hat. I'll have to go back and watch it.And I didn't even see the mysogany. I mean look at some of these women in the GOP. You just wrote an article about what a lowlife POS Maine Senator Susan Collins is and you were point on. Was that piece something against women? She is as ruthless as any man and tries to hide it using being a "moderate" female. I just didn't see or get all of that out of the movie. I will say I hated her by the end and thought she got what she deserved by I'm not sure I wouldn't have felt any differently if it had been a man. Anyway that's my take. Love you man....Can't wait yourher your show in a few minutes
This is EXACTLY how I felt! My husband and I discussed this at length last night trying to figure out why we hated it so much. Even the end was not satisfying enough. It felt empty and hollow, like her death just ties it all up into a nice bow. You nailed it Michelangelo. Thank you for being more articulate than I.
Very interesting perspective Michelangelo. I watched it over the weekend and was both repulsed and dissatisfied by it. I hadn't considered that what repulsed me was a perverted, possibly right wing view of "strong women" or feminism in general.
That being said women who behave just as teribble as powerful men do exist. Maybe they are not criminals, but I've seen it in government, journalism, even in the US Attorney Office. What I've also noticed is that these same women do use exxagerated femininity when it serves their purpose. I feel like this approach holds progress back for all of us. My personal opinion is that we cannot achieve equality by immulating the worst examples of behavior and even if we could that would create a nightmare of a society.
It was frustrating to see this female character be rewarded for her bad actions before being killed in the end.
I also was not aware this was being characterized as an LGBTQ film. The lesbian relationship was barely part of the plot and wasn't developed in any meaningful way. Netflix has done some really good shows that I have felt really humanized LGBTQ characters and this feels like the opposite of that.
Thanks for pointing these things out.
I thought the movie was a great reminder to us that after the pandemic is over, we will still have the largest cohort ever of elders who will need end-of-life care, and the options for that are daunting. What I didn't like was that the evil antagonist was constructed as lesbian, a throwback to the days of the Hayes Commission censorship that allowed queer characters in films so long as they were monsters who got killed in the end. The story could have been just as compellingly disturbing if the con-artist was cis-het.
I knew I shouldn’t watch this movie due to the subject matter (spoke with too many senior customers at a previous temp job who had been scammed by salespersons and it took a toll on me emotionally).
The executive ranks of large companies, entertainment et al are still comprised of mainly white men so until there is more diversity, the bias will continue. And those men need to wake up and be part of the drive for change.
I'm a big Pike fan, since her Gone Girl role. I liked her portrayal, and this movie -- partly because I thought her lesbian relationship was handled pretty well. It was incidental to her character, which is what we want, right? Could have been a submissive man she was bossing around, but it was her tough (dark-skinned) business subordinate. And Pike's character came alive when she rescued her Lesbian Lover! I guess I saw it as a modern take, but one--here you're right, of course--that wouldn't be seen with the subtlety American coastal audiences might bring to it. She's probably going to be seen as the Evil Rich American Dyke abroad. Here in the USA, though, I think we can see her as the Gen-X ice queen who's all about the Benjamins--your Benjamins, that is.
Haven't seen yet, but your thoughtful commentary reminds of me again of the subliminal power of media messages...& how even well-intentioned filmmakers may be too close to see the broader, longterm effects of the stories they tell.
My take on it while watching was at she’s a female Tony Soprano, an anti heroine, but she represents amoral capitalism and exemplifies Trumpian values. That part could have been played by a man or woman, and we want women to have more complicated out-of-the-box parts, so being a bad ass who is also bad didn’t bother me.
I just saw her relationship with her girlfriend as poor writing, because they clearly make her out to be a sociopath and it’s doubtful that that person would be capable of loyalty to another, or feelings of attachment, so I just ignored the lesbian aspect completely. This thing isn’t exactly Citizen Kane.
This is a dystopian possible future being portrayed, where success is gained through screwing the system. She’s Trump, the guy at the end isn’t.
Respectfully disagree on this one, my friend.
Commenting as a homosexual here: sometimes a gay... is just a gay. My partner and I watched it and thought it was a brilliantly dark social commentary. Did not find it homophobic, at all. Just because the anti-hero(s) are lesbian doesn’t mean they are repping lesbianism and LGBTQ+ rights to the world. We are well past the era where any depiction of non-hetero normative relationships in film need to carry a coded flag for the entire crew of us. She was a villain who got her due and she was in a loving relationship with someone who was equally twisted. They are “Bonnie & Bonnie” criminal archetypes.
I don’t buy that it was a Trumpian narrative, either, unless you’re stating that our entire system of elder neglect and craven capitalism is Trumpian; I think that condition predates and subsumes Trump.
Well I can't nix that one off my Netflix list. IMO the Spanish TV series Money Heist (La Casa de Papel) was a better series.
So a guy in a movie can't wear a red hat without being compared to Trump supporter and trying to look into this movie as anything more than what it was is a little ridiculous. Point blank, it was about a horrible person that took advantage of the "law" in that state, allowing her to take advantage of tons of elderly people. She lived her life on the wrong side of the law and morality and got what she deserved. Why does everything have to be politically motivated?
I watched it 2 weeks and I loved it. I didn't see any of the things you saw. TI thought the con artist character was Trump and that her partner was just like the rest of the GOP today. Her being a lesbian didn't make her anymore or less horrible. And yes their are some horrible gay people in the world just like any other group in society. I didn't view the guy who killed her in the end as anyone representing Trump. She had all the characteristics of Trump. I didn't even notice the guy wore a red hat. I'll have to go back and watch it.And I didn't even see the mysogany. I mean look at some of these women in the GOP. You just wrote an article about what a lowlife POS Maine Senator Susan Collins is and you were point on. Was that piece something against women? She is as ruthless as any man and tries to hide it using being a "moderate" female. I just didn't see or get all of that out of the movie. I will say I hated her by the end and thought she got what she deserved by I'm not sure I wouldn't have felt any differently if it had been a man. Anyway that's my take. Love you man....Can't wait yourher your show in a few minutes